Don’t be Dogmatic about Processes Don’t be Afraid to Fail with Joe Natoli

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Joe Natoli

Joe Natoli. Joe is a UX consultant, author and speaker.  He has nearly three decades of experience consulting with and training the product development teams of some of the world’s largest organisations. He has taught over 140,000 students through his online courses and is a regular keynote speaker and lecturer at events across the globe.

In this episode, Phil and Joe Natoli discuss how dogmatically sticking to processes or methodology can lead to failure. They talk about how reliance on process stops you from thinking about and solving the real problem. Joe explains how mentoring helps him and why he does not mind failing sometimes and likes to be pushed out of his comfort zone.


Joe Natoli


Give Good UX – Check out the Joe’s YouTube channel! – Check out Joe’s website!

2 Top Career Tips

1) Dogmatic adherence to process or methodologies, of any kind, is not a good thing. If you are not careful it can end up painting you and the company you are working for into a corner. The real world is messy, so insisting that things be done in a certain order every time is not viable. In the podcast, Joe gives a real world example and demonstrates how inflexibility is disrupting their workflow.
2) Be willing to be wrong and give yourself space to be wrong. There is no need to put pressure on yourself to always be the smartest person in the room. Nobody knows everything. Just keep trying, accept the fact that sometimes you will be wrong. Give yourself enough time to try again.

Show Notes

Worst Career Moment

Joe was working as a consultant for a very large company. His recommendation was to replace a mix of legacy systems with an entire software lifecycle system. Unfortunately, prior to making this decision, he had not been allowed to talk to the guys who were running the current system. When he did he realised that replacing the entire system would send shock waves through the company and cause a lot of damage. In the podcast, Joe explains how he works today to make sure that sort of issue never occurs again.

Career Highlight

The fact that he has been able to help so many other people to progress their career has been a bit highlight for him. It feels good when someone he taught emails him and tells him they are doing well and thanks him for his guidance and support.

The Future

The fact that everything chances so fast is exciting. It keeps you on your toes and keeps you sharp. Joe likes to be pushed out of his comfort zone. For those who work in the UX field the challenges continue to evolve. The fact that human beings are so idiosyncratic means that the work is never likely to get boring. AI and machine learning are going to mix things up even more.

The Reveal

What first attracted you to a career in I.T.?

Joe always enjoyed designing things and has always had an interest in human nature. He can engage in both these passions through his IT career.

What is the best career advice you’ve ever received?

His father told him to speak clearly and plainly. Using jargon and technology only confuses people. Joe explains how that advice advanced his career.

What is the worst career advice you’ve ever received?

Business is business, personal is personal. If you remove the personal part when you create things they won’t be any good at all.

If you had to begin your career again in today’s world, what would you do?

Joe would learn everything he could about everything he could.

What career objectives are you currently focusing on?

Right now, Joe is trying to take on less work. He is still trying to master the skill of time management.

What’s the number one non-technical skill that has helped you in your career so far?

Resilience. At some point things are going to go wrong, it is inevitable. SO, being able to weather those storms is the only thing that will keep you moving forwards.

What do you do to keep your own career energized?

Joe finds that switching off completely, on a regular basis, helps him to stay energised in his career.

What do you do in your spare time away from technology?

Joe enjoys spending time with his family. He is also an artist and musician.

Contact The Guest

Contact Joe Natoli through the following social media platforms:



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Accelerate Your Career Every Week - NOW

Tips & advice for advancing your career. Get my most powerful tips FOR FREE. No spam, ever.

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